Alexandre
Alfa Romeo has come a long way with a low 2022, the launch of the new Tonale SUV does the Italian brand a lot of good. Alfa Romeo announces +136 % registrations in Europe in Q1 2023 compared to Q1 2022.
The brand Alfa Romeo is indeed on the rise for all countries. After very difficult years in 2019, 2020, 2021 and 2022, it is benefiting froma second wind mainly thanks to the new SUV Tonale in countries where the ecological malus is important, and a little thanks to the Giulia and Stelvio restyling for whom the malus is less of a problem.
Although Alfa Romeo's press release is careful not to give exact figures, either in terms of total sales, or the breakdown by country, Here are the unofficial figures we were able to obtain (if Alfa Romeo wants to come and correct them the email box is open).
It is clear that the pre-orders of the Tonale, opened in March 2022, did a lot of good to the Italian brand. Otherwise, it would have sold as many cars as Maserati... Moreover, this had been officially announced, the Tonale had exceeded 20,000 orders by October 2022.
The first quarter of 2023 can therefore be exceptional since the first quarter of 2022 was catastrophic.
The road is still long, as Jean-Philippe Imparato is aiming for 200,000 Alfa Romeo sales per year by 2027. This target could be met with a solid product plan, as the 100,000 sales threshold could be reached as early as 2024 thanks to the Tonale and future electric B-SUV, which will not be called Brennero.
Other interesting figures include Alfa Romeo sales by country for the first quarter of 2023.
These are unofficial figures because the brand does not communicate precisely on sales. For example, China is missing or the month of March 2023 for Belgium and Austria.
However, this gives a good vision since March 2023 shows an upward trend for all countries. This bodes well for the 2nd quarter of 2023.
Alfiste, happy owner of a Giulia Estrema 2.2 L diesel Q4 210 hp, after a Stelvio Sport Edition Q4 210 hp also, a Giulia Lusso diesel in 180 hp, a 159 Selective 1.9 diesel in 150 hp, Mito Selective 1.6 120 hp diesel and a 147 1.9 diesel in 115 hp "I am satisfied, never had any problems" Today, that Alfa wants to play in the premium, there are some points that should be reviewed. First of all, you can't do premium and have a showroom where there are Jeep, Fiat, Suzuki, Opel, and sometimes others. Of course we are waiting for the rebirth of Lancia, but a dealership with Maserati, Alfa and Lancia would be great! This is the big problem at the moment. If I take my sector "Calvados" Maserati shares the same showroom as Jaguar, Land Rover and Volvo. Moreover the Maserati salesman gives you his business card stamped Jaguar ! So it comes from Stellantis. If not Alfa a bit of some finish to review but I love my Giulia Estrema, more red, well Rosso !
I think that Dav has summarized the context well, in order to do Luxo-sports (Maserati), Prenium (Lancia) and pure sports (Alfa) or Jeep (4X4), you need to create a dealership dedicated to them together. Where I don't agree with you is for the Alfa's finishes (at least for the Tonale, whether it's Alexandre or you, you're completely right, it's unworthy of Alfa), the Stelvio and the Giulia really have nothing to envy the competition, except for Lexus, which is doing better (well, since the creation of the brand, they've been indestructible, and even the German models can't compare).
For sales I do not know if wanting to do so much that constructive for the future, only time will tell.
I'm still waiting to see what the future supercar will be like, but it's weird, everywhere in Europe we see a lot of Stelvio and a lot less Giulia but in Switzerland it's the opposite and you can bet that the taxes rot everything and are useless (the proof is that the EVs are stagnating or going backwards)
PS: Alexandre, are you thinking of doing a test drive of the latest Quadrifoglio? Because there is a nice evolution of the product in terms of chassis and mechanics that would be worth comparing with the previous and the first manual version.
Italpassion is not generalist and/or popular enough to be invited to tests like the giulia quadrifoglio by the brand. For the Tonale I had to go through my dealer, that's to say...
So we'll have to help you to organize this because it's the last of the last and it would be a shame not to bid him farewell with a nice tribute video.
It's encouraging but not spectacular either, in any case it's not the new dealership in Lyon Venissieux, with opel, in this building where everything looks mixed that makes you want to go and buy a car from them !!!
How stupid to have removed the agents with whom we have a better contact rather than their showroom building.
For the finish I am less severe than you, especially since we can not all afford premium like the stelvio.
Finally, let's hope that sales continue to rise because we can't say that we see a lot of tonal, even I think I'll keep Juliette and her 2 liters 150 for a long time because 1,5 or 1,3, it doesn't inspire me much, I do a lot of road, mountain and highway, I'm sure they lose sales because of the lack of bigger engine.
Dav, to drive (or even pilot at the request of customers), E & S class, A6 & A8, 5 & 7 series, Panamera, J XE and XF, L ES & LS, Ghibli and Quattroporte 5&6, except for the Lexus ES and LS none of which have a superior interior to the Stelvio or the Giulia (except if you like the dashboards that look like a Christmas tree 🌲 at Christmas time, the E & S Class, A6 and A8 and Panamera are unstoppable for the time being and are real nightmares)
I had to put up with it again yesterday morning in Geneva, because I was stranded on the freeway between Lausanne and Montreux with customers inside... in short, you look like an amateur because of a rolling garbage can (yes, I did say expensive garbage can) !!!!
So much so that more and more professional drivers are saying that Mercedes is missing 2 letters and should have been called Merdecedes for 20 years and that the Panamera should go back to the Porscherie as soon as possible and not come out again!!!!! Fortunately the A6 and A8 there are almost no more (and the international organizations it is finished they are burned).
What is a pity are the consequent problems that we also have in Jaguars because the interior is really nice and pleasant to settle in and this is the kind of product (not especially the design) at Lancia.
Anyway, since Lexus is coming with their van in 2024, Mercedes and VAG are going to collapse without the world of luxury transportation because if they are as reliable as their limousines, it will be a real carnage (that we all wait for like the messiah). When I see Mercedes shouting to anyone who will listen officially that they sell the most Limos in the world, they tend to forget that in the cases of organizations, they sell them the limos for a handful of cherry 🍒 see the offers FREE (for prestige and image).
Do you want proof?
Take a look at the used S-Class for sale in Switzerland with few kilometers at very low prices (but the first maintenance you have to do on this car will cost you more than the car itself).
As for the small engines of the Tonal, it was to be expected and without these damn taxes, I think that the 4 cylinder 2.0 of the Giulia or Ghibli would have been welcome.
I agree with you, I've been saying for years that German cars are overpriced, and Mercedes has started to be taken over by the Chinese. Personally I'm less demanding on the finish, what I like is meters and gauges or indicators.....
Obviously with the taxes, the malus....le tonale did not have a big engine, for me it lacks a modern version of the 1750 of the 4 c and giulietta at the same time it is an alfa Romeo and it is under motorized compared to its cousins 3008 and ds (1,6 hybrid 300cv)
Because once you've used up the 60 km of electricity you end up with a 1300 to tow 1.8 tons if I'm not being silly
Bmw also has small 3 cylinders but they still have larger engines in the catalog
Or you would need a 3 legged koenigsegg 2.0 capable of producing 600hp.
When I talk about finish, I mean assembly because I'm like you, I prefer a thousand times an old-fashioned dashboard!
By chance, as you write rightly, the thing from Peugeot has the engine of the RCZ and strangely it passes the standards???? And not the 1.75???
It stinks of trickery as it is not allowed.
It is only by completing the range that sales will take off. The Tonale is already a good start, even if its only real attraction is its design. In an ideal world, it would have had the right to use the Giorgio platform. But it's mainly the lack of engines that makes it stand out. Even a 3008 has a more convincing engine offer on paper.
I hope the next model will be more successful!
The tonal platform is not a problem I think, except for the press but journalists know nothing about it, they just criticize.
But with the delay in production, we expected a more muscular version, especially compared to the competition, and at least keep the 1.5 for the rechargeable hybrid. The 1750 could well be developed for the new standards and even a hybrid version to lower the malus
Too bad...
Dav if the platform is still a problem.
Look at the Tonale as a whole, do you really think it deserved the Biscione? Because when I see it and thinking about its chassis and its motorizations, it's with a Scorpion 🦂 that I would have seen it and nothing else.
Anthony
Yes, the Giorgio platform was more appropriate and the engines should have gone with it as you rightly write.
The platform has been designed for several cars, it's not because it was first released on the jeep compass that it is not good.
I had a bravo II and then the giulietta which took the same platform but modified, they do not have the same behavior.
Here it's the same, the tonal chassis has been reworked.
The giorgio platform was perhaps too big for the tonal 🤔 in any case it was not the platform that prevented them from putting a bigger engine
At the risk of repeating myself for the Giorgio platform: 1- it's expensive, so it's difficult to make small models that are financially accessible 2- it wasn't designed for electrification... or in other words, battery placement. That's why there is no PHEV or BEV on the giorgio stelvio/giulia/grecale generation. The only exception is the Jeep Grand Cherokee which uses Giorgio and is PHEV...because there is room for batteries in this 5m long car! The platform had to be modified (famous STLA medium and wide) to allow electrification...Grecale folgore, new granturismo, next generation stelvio/giulia...But it will remain reserved to a certain range of models...
At the risk of repeating myself, making Alfa products on a generalist platform will not make Alfa a full-fledged brand that can boast of having products that fit the brand.
The more you pull down... the more the ascent will be insurmountable because the customers having the means to own a Giulia, a Stelvio, will neither go to buy their replacement nor be satisfied with the "so-called" big sedan and it will be another fiasco!
You don't make a donkey 🫏 a racehorse 🏇 even with all the makeup in the world!
Make a survey of customers who own Giulia and Stelvio Quadrifoglio and 4C see 8C, we had fun to do it with some of. Os customers in Switzerland and well the result does not leave any compromise, they will not place any penny in the following and will leave directly to the competition!
Yes Jeep shows that it's possible, so they didn't want to make a big sedan on it... now it's too late, this brand will end up as a simple generalist and its days in the USA are counted!
What you say we can agree or not, it's a point of view in relation to a brand positioning. For my part, it's a technical fact that was brought to my attention by my contact at Maserati/Alfa who worked on these platforms. It's time to look forward and not backward because it's always the same things that are brought up.
If looking ahead means making the same mistakes as in the past, this is called repeating the same pattern!
It is by looking back that we avoid making the same mistakes in the future.
Between the Bravo and the Giulietta there was the Delta and each time heavy modifications were made, in fact between the Fiat and the Alfa there is not much to see and the behavior proves it. In 2010 the Giulietta was rated as the best premium compact car in terms of handling, obviously we are talking about a model below a Giulia (and this is reflected in the price). It was a very good compact car with a remarkable design and the owners who write here are still very happy with it. The finish is average of course, but the base car is very efficient (including in front wheel drive) while remaining comfortable. It is possible to make a very good compact car under 40.000 euros with a correct finish and by limiting the weight (not like BMW...) without disgracing the blazon. The first Giulietta, the original one, had nothing of the 4 tons coach that transported the new king of the English, it was a dynamic car, with a divine taste but with a modest and spartan displacement according to the current criteria.
I was talking about the bravo II released in 2007 like the delta 3
Yes the giulietta is very well on the plan engine / chassis, pity the phase 1 had a dashboard not very pretty and not very "alfa" what slowed down a little the sales I think
The history of the car is full of parts banks sharing... Concerning Alfa, the resumption and modification of Fiat platforms like the Tipo, the C, the Compact, the Premium well reworked to stick to the requirements of the brand, as well as the Fiat engines like the Twin Spark, the Patrola Serra, the MultiAir, the JTD... and not necessarily always in a bad way, even if it's no longer home-made. It's a necessary step, otherwise we would only see Alfa in museums and raduni for a long time.
To produce, heavy investments are needed to make it profitable, and to sell, Alfa is not premium enough to favour margins over volume, like Ferrari, Lamborghini, or even Maserati, which should not be cannibalized at Stellantis. Whether we like it or not, sportiness is no longer in the air, and what brings in money today are SUVs, as evidenced by the success of the Purosangue, Urus, Bentaya, DBX (a deliberate choice). To die with honors or to adapt to survive, such is the dilemma of a brand like Alfa. Let's keep some hope for the future...
Apparently, Alfa Romeo claims 23,402 units sold in the first six months of 2022, compared with 36,737 in the first half of 2023, i.e. a volume increase of 57%.