Alexandre
If there's one engine that doesn't get much press, it's the 1.2 Puretech. Available in all Peugeot, Opel, DS and Citroën models, it will soon be arriving under the hood of certain Italian models. Which models will be affected? Is reliability a legitimate concern? We take stock.
The 1.2 Puretech engine is criticized for its reliability problems. You'll find enough articles on the subject on the Internet, so we won't add to the list, but they range from simple over-consumption of oil to engine failure. The main culprit is the concept of an oil-immersed belt. Numerous angry motorists are currently taking collective action for compensation.
And so, mutualization obliges, this engine will also soon be offered in the catalog of future italian models. Indeed, in addition to their 100 % electric version, a hybrid version with the Puretech engine will be available for the Fiat 600, the future Fiat Panda, l'Alfa Romeo Milano and the Lancia Ypsilon. Should we be afraid? Normally not. These models will have the 3rd generation Puretech engine, which has corrected its weaknesses - the main one being the use of a distribution chain instead of a belt.
All other future Italian models, such as the Alfa Romeo Giulia, Stelvio, Lancia Gamma and Delta, or the Maserati Levante and Quattroporte, will not have Puretech engines, as they will be offered in 100 % electric technology. Fiat's Firefly engine has been left out of the equation.it is offered in the Brazilian Peugeot 208.
An Alfa with a Peugeot engine, and a rotten one at that! I shudder just thinking about it.
More than agreeing with you, a shame
I had been driving a Toyota for 20 years and switched to Citroën, first breakdown 3 days after delivery, 2 months to repair. Immediately afterwards, I went back to Toyota, even though I don't like the model as much... But I sleep soundly, not to mention the customer care.
I'm very much a fiat man and frankly, I have nothing to say. I'm not sure I'll stay with fiat if it's PSA crap.
So do I.
Tipo sw cross 1.5 FPT engine, 4 cylinders..... Excellent.....
Si passage puretech..... I won't stay, after 31 years of satisfaction!!!!
Once you've had a taste of Toyota or Lexus, it's hard to want to go anywhere else, like Mazda, Abarth, Alfa or Maserati, or even Subaru, and Mitsubishi for the older models.
The belt isn't the only problem, the segmentation is also leaky...
In fact, oil consumption is seriously boosted by the choice of 0W30 oil, which is horrendous for the longevity of mechanical parts in friction. Several tests, including some by Stelantis, have demonstrated this. Today, they recommend 5W30 or 40, and oil consumption is immediately divided by 3. You can't grease parts subject to high mechanical loads with water! Hervé.46.
I couldn't agree more.
A PureTech engine in an Italian car is a disgrace!
It's an uninteresting engine, in addition to its reliability problems, which we don't know if they've really been corrected.
Hello the third evolution will be a chain distribution so more reliable with the other defects corrected. As for Italian cars, they are now part of the Stellantis merger, so I have no choice. I'm an Alfa fan, too bad, but that's the way it is.
For the moment, segmentation and sealing problems, excessive oil consumption and turbo weaknesses are not, but not at all.
But yes, that's been corrected. A timing chain instead of a belt is the best. Better late than never!
This doesn't prevent all the other problems that are catastrophic for the engine and its ultra-limited lifespan.
Having rented several cars with this engine, I'd say that it's not so much reliability that scares me as the pleasure of use! Those who like the feeling of a struggling centrifuge will be well served, while others will go and see VW or Nissan. Personally, with the outpouring of disappointment about the Y and Milano articles, I have a feeling I'll be buying a Kia soon.
Those who go to VAG will accumulate just as many problems, because it's no fun.
I confirm....... 😜
I own a Stelvio, it was my last Italian car.
With great regret!
The belt in the oil exists on other engines now this puretech engine will be equipped with a chain so no more belt nevertheless remain the problems of segmentation which makes that one eats oil and vibrations engine which bouzille you a catalyst before the hour.perso I resell my Peugeot for a Skoda I do not have any problem to 55 000 km but I do not trust any more quite simply
Skoda ok, but VAG and Audi definitely not.
Why not VW?
I'm thinking of buying a 265hp Golf GTI 8 phase 2, the latest evolution of the Golf 8.
I started with the Golf GTI, and I'd like to go back to it, as well as the Alfa Romeo I'd keep.
Skoda has been owned by Vag since 91!
Except that Skoda owns the engines that are not pushed by the VAG group, which is why they are spared problems. This is not the case with VAG and Audi in particular, hence the recurring breakdowns.
Stanislas
The first Golf GTi had an indestructible engine, but the rest was a descent into hell. The 8 has software faults, faulty sensors, a warped disc, injection and turbo problems, and its main problem is the junction between a separator plate and the side member, which may have been poorly made. This separating plate, located at the front of the vehicle, could become detached or generate noise on uneven road surfaces, and the cylinder head problem (also a chronic problem on VAG 5-cylinders) could impair engine operation. A check of the casting marks on the cylinder head will then be carried out.
Yet Skoda's diesel injection components are in the lower range than those fitted to VW. I speak as a diesel specialist.
Skoda verbaut die gleichen Teile wie VW / Audi / Seat
I bought a c3 in september 2024, is it concerned by this problem?
I wouldn't advise you to tap into it, just check your oil level every 250km and, above all, divide maintenance by 2.
Between now and September, you'll have plenty of time to cancel your order!
Even if it's a chain, the engine still consumes as much oil as a rotary piston engine, can't stand the slightest over-revving and still breaks like crystal like the THP.... In short, nothing has changed, so yes, you should be horrified, and above all, you should buy this, because PSA and Stellantis refuse to issue recalls or carry out repairs on their own account, which is a disgrace, and that's why so many customers have set up collective complaints to take the group to court.
Have you noticed? It's not just the chain that's been modified..... Its problems were oil consumption and the timing belt. Both problems are solved by a modified timing chain and pistons...
Segmentation still lacking, turbo still in crystal version and vibration poorly contained. Consumption still surreal. In short, there's still a lot of work to be done to make it playable.
I always thought that China would break up the beautiful European brands.
But at this rate, there's no need to be afraid. The Europeans are ready to beat the hell out of themselves, without the help of anyone else.
And electric cars are something to forget!
Don't want that! Note just one detail: the battery in a cell phone is extremely dangerous for human beings.
What do you think about the impact on human health of sitting on batteries all day?
What a massacre, not only in terms of styling (the future cubic Milano) but also in terms of road feel, agility and now powertrains.
I'd hoped that Stellantis and his CEO would demonstrate their passion for the brand, but all they seem interested in is hyper-profitability.
And the electric 100% seals the coffin...
Farewell to Alfa, and its shoddy network.
An Alfa with a Peugeot engine is like a pineapple pizza!
Alfiste since 1980. I accepted the corosion, the light finish, the Fiat engines but there was the alfa Romeo soul!!!! Its Italian engines!!!
There, really, I can not!!! I'm keeping my gtv v6 turbo my wife's mito.ma 156 2.4 jtd, then we'll move on!
The chassis was Fiat, but the engines were Alfa. Corrosion is mostly a problem under the Italian state, and what brand hasn't had a corrosion problem anyway? When I see how the Porsche 996 is riddled with corrosion, the Golf, BMW and even Mercedes, nobody escapes it, not even the ultra-reliable Japanese.
YOU HAVE TO BE A KAMIKAZE TO BUY STELLANTIS.
Having bought a Kia, I'm disappointed too, my sportage is going to pieces, poor quality leather that's stained all over, engine steering wheel changed twice, car radio bug, 7-year cardboard warranty, engine steering wheel and car radio not included in the warranty. No Kia for me, never again. And I'm not talking about the gargantuan oil consumption or the whistling sunroof....
It's quite rare, but it does happen.
The Italian automobile is dead... There's none of the soul that you could find with a V6 busso or even the 2.0 lampredi of the Lancia Delta (a fiat coupé for me... I love this car so much! Mine will be 30 years old next year!) The range of the former fiat group has become almost as banal as a 208 or a C3... No more Italian identity, apart from the coat of arms on the grille... Too bad...
P.s: for the person disappointed by Kia: bad luck for you:... I have one (Sportage 4) and I'm very happy with it! Sorry for your bad experience...
The former Fiat group owned a 500 and Abarth, a 124 and Abarth, a 4C, a Giulietta with the 4C engine, a Giulia, a Stelvio V6 , a 33 and the whole Maserati range, but since Stellantis we can fear the worst, because what did PSA own???? Nothing!
It's a shame to leave out the Firefly engine, which runs on E100 in Brazil....
It's the Firefly T3 fitted to my 2020 Tipo 4-door sedan, and I'm very happy with it: it's economical, pleasant to use, and accepts 55% of E85 natively.... (I've driven 34,000 km with this blend, without any box or reprog)
6.7L/100 at 130 permanent car loaded and a little air conditioning, 5.5L/100 on roads, and not with the computer but calculated in real from full to full on long journey...
All engines accept 50/50 (apart from carburettors), just don't exceed that if you don't have the box. Ethanol is best suited to high-revving engines such as Honda K,C and F, Alfa Twin Spark and, better still, Mazda rotary piston engines. Using 50/50 ethanol also burns off deposits in the fuel tank and engine.
Unfortunately
It's not just the 1.2 pure tech that's rotten
Their adbleu systems and the 1.6hdi engine
Also unreliable
The group is growing by leaps and bounds. But the quality is really low
It's really sad
Yes, I confirm, I have a 1.5 hybrid firefly on Tipo cross sw....... I love this car
Perhaps the last vestige of the automotive spirit.
After ?????????
they would have been better off upgrading the TU engine
It's really frustrating to have ruled out the FireFly, which must surely be cheaper to produce as well. But the CO2 emissions must surely be higher.
It's a shame, and even frustrating, because the little 1.3 is much nicer and more reliable than the PireTech ...
FireFly engine with a lot to offer low consumption for a rather high range for a small fuel tank 39l it is possible to reach more than 700km of range, nervous engine not very powerful but largely enough powerful, very reactive, puretech pushy, the new panda with pure tech I think it will be 1T5, while the current panda weighs only 100kg more than the panda 2 th generation is less 1T.
A hollow engine with no elongation whatsoever, in the PSA tradition... even if it's made reliable, it's of no interest.
I'm also passionate about Italian cars, especially Alfa Romeo. I own a tonale with the Firefly. I don't understand why this 4-cylinder engine isn't more popular with other brands in the group. Fuel consumption is reasonable for the weight of the vehicle, but above all it's a 4-cylinder. In short, to put an engine with this reputation when Alfa already suffers from an unfounded bad reputation is simply very bizarre, but surely justified by an economic choice.
This will be my last Alfa, as I read above, I don't mind the presence of fiat but I don't want to buy a rebadged Peugeot. Despite the anti-car pressure, I still like cars, so my choices won't be guided by the dictates of an industrial group or environmental and political dictates.
Long live free esparto!
Unfortunately
It's not just the 1.2 pure tech that's rotten
Their adbleu systems and the 1.6hdi engine
Also unreliable
The group is growing by leaps and bounds. But the quality is really low
It's really sad
The THP is just as catastrophic as the puretech.
We're back to the early '80s, when only Asian brands offered engine reliability worthy of the name ... even if today, for some of these brands - it's important to find out where the engine comes from!
When you see the price of vehicles these days, this situation is simply scandalous!
What about the gumming of the segments that causes overconsumption? Has this been revised?
The Firefly, with its many variants, was supposed to be the engine of the future for Fiat, Lancia and Alfa. Too bad! The Fire and Multijet engines (1990-2020) were excellent, sober, smooth and very reliable. For me, Italian cars are a thing of the past, even though I've been a loyal customer for 40 years. As for electric cars, they're only interesting for very limited suburban use, and only if you have a garage with a power socket. And all this to please the ecologists who are hostile to the freedom to travel by car... who I have a feeling will do remarkably well in the European elections. So far, my Peugeot blue HDI is not causing any problems. And yet, I believe that the timing chain on this engine has been strengthened from 7 to 8 millimeters by 2022. I'll remind you of the average fuel consumption, 3.9 liters per cent of diesel, just to thumb my nose at the green ideologues and worshippers of the goddess Gaya. I'm ordering the new Suzuki Swifft full option non-rechargeable hybrid in the spring. And Fiat, Lancia and Alfa will become, alas, collector cars, like Maserati and Ferrari! Viva Italia, con antipasti et pesto de burrata ...
Guitou
I'm an environmentalist, but like many environmentalists, we know very well that the electric car is an aberration.
After that, diesel should be reserved for long-distance use, and bio-ethanol is a viable solution when it's created from organic waste of all kinds, for example, while we wait for hydrogen. We mustn't confuse ecologists with eco-economists, who are just there to make more money 💰 on people's backs and who don't give a damn about flora and fauna.
- Lapsus calami: Chaine without circumflex and Gaïa like this.
They're no longer automakers, but rather assemblers of tasteless environmental hassles that we find wrapped up in all the packaging of an octopus 🐙 without a care in the world. Worse still, mass-produced engines that used to be reliable because they were tried and tested in large numbers are no longer so, thanks to a so-called devastating ecology!
I've worked with Germans, Koreans and French manufacturers, and all this is due to the ever-increasing pollution control standards, which inevitably weaken engines. We've also forgotten that the car was designed to go from point A to point B, connectivity screens, etc. These are all sources of problems, believe me.
For the moment, problems at Lexus are rare, very, very rare.
The Italian automobile is dead... There's none of the soul that you could find with a V6 busso or even the 2.0 lampredi of the Lancia Delta (a fiat coupé for me... I love this car so much! Mine will be 30 years old next year!) The range of the former fiat group has become almost as banal as a 208 or a C3... No more Italian identity, apart from the coat of arms on the grille... Too bad...
P.s: for the person disappointed by Kia: bad luck for you:... I have one (Sportage 4) and I'm very happy with it! Sorry for your bad experience...
I had the 208 1.2 puretech, and covered 160,000 km.
No worries at all, I didn't even change the belt.
Before criticizing everything, ask yourself about maintenance. Change the engine oil every 10,000km, check the oil level, which nobody does.
Oil 5/30. I could do a one-page article, I don't type fast enough.
Sincerely
On no account, because the belt heats up in the oil due to poor quality. Segmentation, vibration and turbo problems, even with regular maintenance.
It's strange that there are so many collective complaints in progress by the thousands and that, as if by chance, no one has serviced their engine or had it serviced. Sorry, but it just doesn't add up.
5 million engines sold.... There aren't that many complaints when you consider how many of these vehicles have been on the road over the past 10 years. On the other hand, the engine does require irreproachable maintenance. Oil quality, frequency of oil changes etc...
It's really funny how stubborn an engine can be when it's not ready to stellantis this 3-cylinder purtech, which is a real calf handicapped by an interminably long gearbox that can't cope with high revs and even less so with low revs. Mine started clarinating the timing at around 20.000kms it reminded me of my SIMCA 1100 of 1973 I quickly sold the ugly duckling it's a shame to go to the end of the bullshit to realize that it is indeed a bullshit
That says it all 👍
It can't be said that this is due to the number of cylinders, as Koenigsegg has succeeded in creating a 3-cylinder 2.0 biturbo with 600hp and 600nm, climbing to 8,5000rpm with formidable reliability. If PSA at the time wanted a real engine for hybrid applications, they could simply contact them. It's really the engine design that's at fault.
1. When I chose the Citroën Cactus with the Pur-Tech 110 hp engine, I was hoping for a hassle-free driving experience.
2. Unfortunately, after just 115,000 km, I was faced with a major disappointment: an alarming over-consumption of engine oil.
3. Every 600 km, I had to add almost a liter of oil, turning every journey into a constant preoccupation.
4. This over-consumption not only cost me dearly in terms of maintenance, but also marred my driving experience.
5. The disappointment was palpable every time I had to stop to check and add oil, spoiling the pleasure of driving.
6. The idea of a modern car with such an oil-hungry engine seemed outdated and disappointing.
7. I had to part with my Cactus much earlier than planned, a difficult decision dictated by disappointing mechanical reliability.
8. Hoping for a smooth, economical ride turned into a series of worries and unexpected expenses.
9. The initial enthusiasm for my Cactus dissipated, giving way to deep disappointment in the choice of the Pur-Tech engine.
10. In the end, the promise of a hassle-free driving experience evaporated, leaving behind a costly lesson in the importance of mechanical reliability.
A chain but with plastic rollers, so the problem is shifted to low-quality segmentation. Motor to be avoided.
I own a Gulia and this will be my third and last Afa. A magnificent car, I must say.
Can someone explain to me why the 'rotten' PURE TECH engines are selling well (208 leader in January 2024) and the wonderful FIAT engines aren't?
Since when do good sales mean that a car that sells well is a good car?
People are often sheep who know nothing and buy what they think is right without question.
Exactly Stanislas
And if he's so good, why are so many thousands of people in France getting together to file a collective complaint, followed by several lawyers to support them?
Ah well, that's strange, because puretech is still selling in France, and if you count the number of Fiat engines sold worldwide compared with Peugeot's, well, there's no comparison.
Yes, prejudices die hard, aided and abetted by a self-appointed press.
Personally, I let go of my prejudices in 1993.
Since then, it's been all right...... Today Tipo cross 1.5 firefly SW (4 cylinders)...... An everyday pleasure.
There are already cases of filings in the oil on the new puretoc, chain tensioner, aac dephaser... gone are the days of tu or xud engines and more recently the first 2L hdi. I'm not even talking about the dv6 and more recently the dv5😓 . In short, what a poem these m...e engines are!
Ah ok, it has the same symptoms as THP in a nutshell.
To think that they stopped the ESL9, capable of producing 255hp in 3.0 liters, to come up with this... appalling!
Não entendo porque firefly Fiat não está no lugar desse problemático motor PSA, somente no Brasil onde existem vários Argos com 300k km a rodar sem problemas. Parecem que gostam de problemas para ganharem em cima de peças e manutenções
Non esistono motori privi di difetti, questo è il male minore, il vero problema è quando non ci si assume delle proprie responsabilità, e Stellantis a quanto pare è la classica azienda che pensa esclusivamente al profitto fregandosene del cliente ... e tutto ciò è inammissibile, da quel che ho capito la loro garanzia è solo sulla carta, non nei fatti.
Ho 73 anni ho cambiato la bellezza di 23 auto ( tutte usate) non ho mai avuto nessun problema né elettrico o meccanico. Un anno fa ho deciso di aquistare una
Auto nuova confortevole C4 Citroen , quando ho saputo le problematiche di queste auto ,Citroen Peugeot Opel e altre.........mi sono caduti gli ZEBEDEI !!!!!!
Bin bisher mit allen Peugeot und Citroen zufrieden gewesen. Fahre zur Zeit einen BlueHDi150. Keine Probleme. Zuvor HDi92, BlueHDI99, C4-I 109 PS, Xsara 1.8 (110 PS), .... Denke, die Probleme sind bekannt. Kein falsches Öl einfüllen und den Zahnriemen kontrollieren. Thats it. Und Probleme gibt es bei jedem Hersteller. Und sogar bei denen, die wesentlich teurer sind.
Too funny the comments of the experts here. It's like BFmtv auto here. Technical reality is often more complex than just the bistro comments of some old mechanics. Take the oil story, for example. Honda and Toyota have been using 0w16 oil for over 10 years now, for example, and yet there's been no engine failure. Simply because the quality of an oil has little to do with its viscosity.